63. Set Jetting on board the Resilient Lady with Richard Lawson of Vanity Fair & Molly Rogers of And Just Like That

Join me live from the luxurious Resilient Lady with the fabulous Richard Lawson and the trendsetting Molly Rogers! In this episode, we dive into Richard's newfound love for cruising, Molly's unique insights on dressing our favorite SATC characters, and even divulge some juicy behind-the-scenes tidbits from "And Just Like That."

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This episode was produced by The Podcast Teacher.

Transcript

Michele:

Ahoy, sailors. Get ready to set sail on a virtual episode like no other. Join me, the fabulous Richard Lawson, and the trendsetting Molly Rogers live aboard the luxurious resilient lady as we transport you to the enchanting world of the Greek Island Glow Subs in the City fan cruise. We are up here on Richard's rooftop, which is a special venue reserved exclusively for rock stars and VIPs. I mean, this is the shit. The best views on the ship, a private bar, champagne every day at 5, but most of all is this fabulous couch seating that I did post pictures of on my Instagram stories, just so you know. You can spread out and work just like we're doing now, but I'm not gonna lie to you. The audio is gonna definitely be a little bit different because we're using my MacBook Air.

Michele:

But before you hear from Molly and Richard, I do have some big news to share with you. Jet Setting With Me is now a top 100 podcast in the travel category. I mean, oh, I never thought that it would happen, so thank you. And if you haven't hit the check mark to follow this podcast to make sure that you download and listen to each and every episode. I would love it if you would do that at this time. If you find a favorite or there's one you can't wait to share with a friend, maybe this one that you're about to hear right now, please share it with that person. And, of course, if you are so inclined, leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you catch jutsetting with me. And without further ado, here is my conversation with Richard and Molly.

Michele:

Okay. So, Richard, when we first met, you mentioned that you were a hesitant cruiser. So now that we're more than halfway in, which makes me sad to say, how do you feel and would you do this again?

Richard:

Oh, I think I'm a convert. Yeah. Yay.

Michele:

Yay. I converted him.

Richard:

I my fear was always that I would feel trapped with a bunch of strangers and there was nowhere to go because we're in the ocean. But in fact, all the ports at home have been really easy to navigate. And then but what I'm really surprised by is how much I've enjoyed my time on the actual boat. Like, the meals have been great. The downtime has been lovely. And I think it really forced me, which is not my natural mode, to just kind of slow down, quiet my brain a little bit. You know, I'm still on my phone, of course, but, with limited because it's, you know, it's just limited Wi Fi. But but, yeah, it's been really great, and a and a nice new surprise, you know, well into my traveling life, I guess.

Michele:

Cool. Molly, I picked this cruise and this line based on the fact that season 2 ended in Greece. Can you see our 4 friends and and their their new enhanced friends and family enjoying this?

Molly:

I think it would be a wonderful episode, if not

Michele:

more than 1. Mhmm.

Molly:

It is absolutely right for humor, all the shenanigans that they could get into on this ship. And, of course, I would want the writers to at least have one person, maybe Mario, miss the boat

Michele:

once. Oh, Mario.

Molly:

Because he wanted to stay in Mykonos.

Richard:

So Oh, gee. I wonder why. Yeah.

Michele:

Oh, I can totally see that.

Molly:

Yeah. I think you could I mean, what a great setting, you know, for a episode show. There's only been a one show about cruise ship. Right? The one in the eighties?

Richard:

The love boat. Yeah.

Molly:

The love boat. And what how great was that? Special guest stars every episode?

Michele:

Oh, in the nineties, that's how I got the nickname Julie McCoy, cruise director.

Molly:

You're kidding.

Michele:

It was because Julie McCoy was a cruise director on The Love Boat, and I was always planning and, like, gathering people, and I was, like, forcing her.

Molly:

Nature.

Michele:

Yeah. So they my best friend gave me that name.

Molly:

That's so funny.

Michele:

It stuck. I still am a goose dreamer. Am. Yep. So how would you dress any of our fabulous characters for Scarlet Night? Any of them. I'm not gonna and I'm not gonna even hold you in. So I

Molly:

I well, I love to people watch, so I was out and about last night seeing what people were featuring, and I think I would've tried to put a little twist on it. I didn't see a lot of wigs, which I thought would be fun, you know, to slap some crazy scarlet wig on. Carrie does not wear red. I've put, and over the years I feel like I've put her in like one red dress and it was faded, vintage, you know, it looked kind of like you'd pulled it out of an old closet. So she would be a tough one actually. I don't even know if she would go for a red shoe, a candy apple red shoe, a LOU BOUTINE. But then she could have the soles, the red soles on them. So maybe that would count.

Richard:

I'm imagining a comedy moment where Charlotte misunderstands and comes dressed as Scarlett O'Hara.

Molly:

Good one. Yeah.

Michele:

Very, you know, man.

Richard:

Open that. You know?

Michele:

Yeah. Yeah. That's funny because I'm on this show, I have felt most like Scarlett in the very recent episode where she had to wear shapewear with everything. Because I feel like like even my bathing suit, I'm, like, stuck in

Molly:

the mirror. Even a bathing suit these days feels like a girdle. Like, it's really I don't like I don't like them. Yeah. It's true. That's funny. Yeah. I think a lot of people related to that Spanx or whatever, you know, shapewear episode.

Molly:

A lot of people, a lot of women

Michele:

Definitely. In drag plays.

Richard:

I think people would probably assume because she's, you know, written as such a fashionista that Carrie is the most fun character to dress. But who's another one that you, like, are like, oh, I I I'm excited to put some clothes on them?

Molly:

Well, Stanford.

Richard:

Oh, of course. Yeah. Of

Molly:

course. Like, we just

Michele:

A different style of town.

Molly:

You would just run through stores. I don't care where you were and you would be like, oh my god. That's a Stanny shirt.

Richard:

Mhmm. Yeah.

Molly:

It would just jump out at you or you'd be in a store and somebody would say, this is a good Stanford tie. You know, someone that worked there. So he was a lot of fun. But honestly for shenanigans, it has nothing to do with whatever he was wearing. It was Mr. Big. Oh, thank you. His fittings were last riots.

Richard:

Oh, wow.

Molly:

And he wanted to do everything but get his clothes on. Right. You know, he wanted to gossip, He wanted to play. He wanted to,

Michele:

you know A man of my own heart.

Molly:

What a fun, fun guy. What a great guy.

Michele:

I miss big. I was always team big. Yeah. Always team big.

Richard:

Mhmm. Yep. Yep. I never felt for Aidan.

Molly:

Really fun fittings.

Michele:

Yeah. Yeah. And and okay. Let's talk about Aidan for a second because we there have been some spoilers on Instagram

Molly:

Oh, really?

Michele:

That he was back for at least one episode Yeah. And seen throwing rocks

Molly:

Yeah.

Michele:

At what I can only assume is the Gramercy Park Apartments.

Richard:

Right.

Molly:

Yes. I think that's all the knowledge now.

Michele:

He was smoking. Which is

Richard:

that been again. Yes. That's right.

Michele:

Please tell me that was the after and not It's

Molly:

him. Yeah. It's him coming out of his trailer with a sick they took pictures of him with cigarettes. Right? I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. He's doing that.

Richard:

Yeah. With Aiden. No.

Michele:

I didn't think so because there was some of the comments were, like, what? He's making it snowmoking now? Right. So yeah.

Molly:

I know what he's up to.

Michele:

Do we know how many episodes he's gonna be in? I do. She's not telling episodes he's gonna be in?

Molly:

I do.

Michele:

She's not telling us. She's not gonna tell us. Okay. Well, so, Richard, what are you most looking forward to in season 3? Are you do you watch it?

Richard:

Oh, religiously. I did a podcast about it.

Molly:

Okay. And alright.

Richard:

Yeah. I

Michele:

So he's got a great podcast, Molly.

Molly:

Yeah. Okay. Good to know.

Richard:

All of season 2 episode by episode.

Molly:

Oh, you did? Yeah. Yeah.

Richard:

Yeah. We interviewed you for it. Who? We interviewed you for it.

Molly:

You did? Did I have fun? Yeah. You

Richard:

had a great time.

Molly:

Okay. Cool. I can't now I'm starting to of

Richard:

Yeah. It was over the phone

Molly:

so it wasn't Okay. Okay. Cool. Cool. That's great.

Richard:

I I what I've really loved about watching the show and Just Like That, you know, it's just like it it evolving and sort of getting more comfortable with the new characters and really interweaving them with the old and, like, something that the show has a lot of territory to have to explore because there are these new people and everyone's in a different stage of life, and so I'm excited to see

Molly:

I think that, you know you know, when you're a true fan of something Mhmm. You well, from what I've felt from people is season 1, that when you're a true fan, you don't wanna see anything change. You don't wanna see people get older. You don't wanna see anything but what you fell in love with, you know, like for example, I love a movie called Overboard with Goldie.

Michele:

I love that movie.

Molly:

They remade it, I would never go see that remake Right. Because you would never do better than Goldie and Kurt Yeah. And the and that script. You know, I worked on The Devil Wears Prada. They're gonna they doing that on Broadway or whatever. I'm sure I would never go because I thought that movie was pretty dark.

Michele:

It was amazing.

Molly:

Pretty it held up. It had

Richard:

legs. Yeah.

Molly:

So I felt like it was really a tall order as writers or anyone that worked on it to have so much change in season 1, death, everything, that, that, that. You know, right off the bat, you know, right when it opened season 1 and mister Big died. I thought it was a lot to ask fans who don't wanna see anything happen or time. Time needs to stand still and Carrie should always be able to wear a miniskirt and a halter top. You know?

Richard:

Right. Yeah.

Molly:

That's the Carrie they love, and Yeah. I think it was a lot to ask, but for me having worked on it for so long, I wanna find out where does this where does it really go? When does it end? Yeah. How does it end?

Richard:

And I think those big changes, like, forced the audience or forced me anyway to be, like to confront the things the show is trying to be about, which is, like Right. Time does pass and things do change. And, like, I think that we as audience members, we're, like, oh, right. This can't be preserved in Amber forever.

Molly:

Exactly. And, you know, Michael Patrick King said he always gives one buzzword. Season 1 is about change. And I I noticed that in my own personal life, when I have been resistant to it, things got a lot harder.

Richard:

Yeah.

Molly:

Do you know when you try and force an outcome of something, no. You gotta go with the flow and what happens happens. Totally. Yeah. Okay. That's fine.

Michele:

I have to mention the hat. This recent one? This yes. Yeah. This big brown hat. So first of all, where did you locate it? Well, a lot What statement are you making with it?

Molly:

A lot of things that we find, all of us, the shoppers, me, Danny, anyone, I have to say a lot of people that we meet and find and it's so easy to communicate on is Instagram. And that is how someone was looking, I think it was Danny, and it came up on his feet, that big hat he called. We have a lot of her hats in the room. And I was shocked. During SJ's fitting, she walked over and picked it up and tried it on. She was like, oh, this is a winner. And it was a lot of hat, but we were like, we got nothing to lose, let's do it. You know, you already get raped over the coals for other stuff, so let's get dragged on this.

Molly:

It's worth it.

Richard:

Well, any publicity.

Michele:

I was gonna say yeah. Well, people are talking about it.

Molly:

What was interesting is the designer of that hat, Mary something something something, she's in London, and the girls came out and did that scene in, Washington Square Park, I think, a week ago. And she DM'd us on Instagram later that day and said, I've had 6 orders already. Now who who I wanna meet the people that are running around in this huge, floppy, gingham, brown Yes. It's kinda brown. Gingham hat. Who ordered that hat? Who is wearing it this summer? Well, I

Michele:

love it. Ice field for, people in in Sydney. Yeah. She's really excited. Not sure when I saw the look from head to toe, but then I saw a close-up of face and hat, and I thought, she can fucking pull that off. Mhmm. Like, I was really impressed.

Molly:

What would you say she hasn't

Michele:

pulled off?

Molly:

Is there something in your mind that you were like, that didn't really work for me?

Michele:

I think there's From from the original.

Richard:

One of the more infamous outfits involved a fanny pack, I believe. And those have now come back in Vogue. And so you look at this outfit that people used to be like, oh, that's Carrie's worst outfit, and you're

Molly:

like, no.

Richard:

It's Hannah Shieff.

Molly:

They all That was a crazy outfit.

Richard:

Either lasted the test, like, the the test of

Michele:

time Right.

Richard:

Or they've gotten better as they've aged. You know? Where, like, I look back at some hours where I was like, I don't know. But now, with hindsight, they're great. You know? I don't really think there is an actual bad look. They're all interesting, if nothing else.

Michele:

Interesting. That's a good point for it.

Richard:

Yeah.

Molly:

It's good. It's I think it's really good to try and keep Pat's legacy of there are no rules. You know? It's like it's really good to do that. Yeah. It's television. People need to watch for some reason either, you know, the visual or whatever, the writing.

Richard:

And every Carrie scene when it you're like, okay. What's she gonna be in now? You know?

Michele:

Oh, I love yeah.

Richard:

Whole thing.

Molly:

So And we try we try desperately that if it doesn't shoot on an exterior that, you know, we don't show it on our account. You know, we Right.

Richard:

Keep it in there.

Molly:

Try to let there be something in the episode that no one has seen and it's not burnt.

Richard:

And Yeah. Yeah. Well, I can't wait.

Michele:

That must be getting harder and harder to do.

Molly:

It is. But at least when you're on a studio lot in Queens, you know, she can go downstairs from her, they can all go downstairs from her their dressing rooms and go right onto the stage so nobody's gonna catch them outside. So you can keep interior stuff pretty pretty on the down low.

Richard:

That's good because I wanna be surprised.

Michele:

Yeah. Yeah. I do too. So if you were not here with us on this sailing, what is a day on set like for you, Molly? Like,

Molly:

well, let's see. Right now, they're shooting, and I'm not there. I'm playing hooky with you 2. Okay. Thank you. We're very appreciative. Very, very happy too. The weather has been beautiful.

Molly:

Anyway, really, really have enjoyed it. For example, today, they're shooting on the stage in Carrie's apartment all day long, and I would probably have to be there at 6 AM. I like to be there when she's there going into the works, hair and makeup, because you just it's a courtesy to number 1 on the call sheet. You go when she goes. You know? And case there's any kind of question, but there usually isn't any issues. She knows what she's gonna wear. The hair dye knows. There's a hat.

Molly:

There's not a hat or whatever. So it's just a courtesy.

Richard:

She's pretty involved in the clothing too.

Molly:

She's involved in everything.

Richard:

Yeah.

Molly:

She is very, what do you call it? Collaborative. You need to train her

Michele:

because she but all the ladies now are executive producers. I should say all the original ladies.

Molly:

Right.

Michele:

So were they as hands on or is it just SJP?

Molly:

They are. The fitting room is a safe zone, and you can express your opinion. And if you don't like the way something looks on you and I happen to love it, I'm not gonna force you to wear it. It's like, no way. You feel good in that? I like it too. Let's let's do it. But, Sarah Jessica, it I learned a great lesson from her. What was the year? The first year of the show was 1998 maybe.

Molly:

I had never met anyone so detail oriented besides Patricia Fields. And I came to the conclusion, and you probably know this because you were successful as well, and you, attention to detail, like to a maniacal level, equals, in my mind, success. Yeah. You do not take for granted that someone's gonna know how you want that cuff. Do you know what I mean?

Michele:

Oh, go ahead. You She's stressing me. This is like a a moment for me, listeners.

Molly:

It was just you take care of every tiny detail so that when you hopefully see it in the episode, every single thing about it, you love. Now that is literally impossible to do. You know, Michael Patrick King, and it's true, he always says to me, I've stopped giving you compliments because you don't know how to accept them, because he will come over to me by the monitor and say, everything looks so great, but I will see a tie knot. Of course. Right. And he will be like, oh, god. You're awful. But and I've tried to learn to be more, yes, it does.

Molly:

Thank you. But I see 20 mistakes. You know? But it it's difficult. But that's one thing I learned from Pat and Sarah Jessica. You just it's controlling the visual. I think there's no s j in the original show used to to ask the props department, and it helped with the total vibe of the show. These are the magazines that should be on Carrie's coffee table.

Richard:

Yeah.

Molly:

British, you know, this, Vogue, this, that, and the other, Elle, Tatler, whatever. It, all those little pieces made that show's, you know, made it hip, cool. She didn't have like, what would be stupid for Carrie to have on her coffee table reading, she wouldn't read well, it would be cool if she had the onion. Yeah. Yeah.

Michele:

You You know

Molly:

what I mean?

Richard:

She's not reading Guns and ampoules.

Molly:

It's like all those little things, the stuff I've hang in the closet. Like, I've been chewing we're on episode 2 now, shooting. I've been thinking to myself, when am I gonna lay that pigeon purse in the closet? When do I think that's a good moment when she walks through and it's just over there in the corner? You know, little things like that you wanna do for people because they'll look at everything. I posted something yesterday in, Beau Jersey. I did see that. And I was, like, it's wonderful here.

Michele:

You were shopping, you were shopping. I

Molly:

was like I'm looking for a caftan, 65, French,

Richard:

you know,

Molly:

I was trying to do that finance

Richard:

song. Right. And

Molly:

I had my feet in the photo, and everybody's like, what's wrong with your toes? What's wrong with your toes? I was like, oh my god. They notice everything. I have an ingrown toenail. It's like, oh my god. That's why I feel very specific about what does the camera see because the fans see Yeah. Everything, and I wanted to see a lot. So you're

Michele:

you watch television for a living. Right? So with the critics' eye, how many before you do a podcast episode, let's say, how many times do you watch the episode to try and hone in on those details?

Richard:

If I'm doing a podcast about it, I do at least twice. You know? Because the first one is just to kind of okay. Like, this is what the episode is about. And then the second is to really try to find those specifics. Yeah. Exactly. Because, like, just doing a broad generalized, like, recap of the plot, that's not really worth tuning into.

Michele:

Right.

Richard:

Right. But, like, you wanna kinda go granular either in a silly way, like, oh, let's talk for 10 minutes about this Right.

Molly:

Or whatever. Let me extrapolate.

Richard:

Yeah. Or it's, like, noticing how an episode is sort of structured in terms of, like, well, this scene led to this scene and, you know, you don't always pick that up on the first viewing.

Molly:

Right.

Richard:

So I try to be I mean, it it's a treat to do with something like in Just Like That. Sometimes with darker shows like the new Game of Thrones series or, you know, anything in that sort of realm, violent, whatever, that's a little bit more trying to sort of but, like, rewatching an episode just just like that is a treat. I mean, it's

Molly:

It's light hearted. Yeah. Nobody's head is getting

Michele:

choked up. I have to watch it once, then I'll listen to the podcast Right. Because I count on your eyes and ears to pick up those details that as a casual watcher well, I'm not a casual watcher. I mean, I'm a rabbit watcher, but Right. I still don't pick up on all of those things. And so I listen, and then I watch again to rewatch it, hopefully, with your eyes and ears. So that's but I I try and notice things like, the pigeon purse being in the closet. You Or

Molly:

You prop you if not both of you, I know that you and and lots of people know more and remember more than I do.

Michele:

Well, I know I I remember a lot more than some of the actors and actresses, but they're not always on the set for everybody else's scenes. Agree. And I didn't real I did not know that until I was listening to a West Wing podcast Okay. With with one of the actors. And he wasn't there when, like, Yo Yo Ma was on set because it wasn't on his call sheet. I was like, but I assume that they know everything that's happening. They're because

Molly:

the guest star like this.

Michele:

I do. I remember a lot. But my friends and I have a joke that I can talk in lines from and just well, from Sex and the City. Like, I can I remember certain

Richard:

things?

Michele:

Certain I

Richard:

mean, if we watched it so

Michele:

long ago.

Richard:

About 10 years ago, I did for work, like, the definitive ranking of Sex and Sex seasons, you know, like, I mean, worst is not the right word, but, you know, most favorite, most favorite. And so I rewatched the whole series for probably the 3rd time. Woah. But now, 10 years later, I'm like, time for a revisit. Maybe I'll

Michele:

Oh, I yeah. We remissed it at auction.

Molly:

Oh my god.

Michele:

I really

Richard:

like that. In earlier seasons partly because they're on Delta right now. But, like, I'm just I'm noticing more things. I think it because speaking into the change of it just like that, like, I'm older than I was when the show premiered, obviously. And so I'm in a much more, like, a I'm older than Carrie is in season 1, certainly. Right. Most of the seasons of of the show, actually. Wow.

Richard:

And so, like, kind of seeing it from that perspective is awesome. So it really just keeps, you know, evolving, I guess. And then but which makes it even more exciting that we also have new stuff coming from

Michele:

I love the new stuff too. Right. I really do.

Richard:

Like, our line on the podcast was always, like, honestly, I would watch these people read the film. I don't really care what I'm doing.

Molly:

Yeah. I feel that way about it sometimes as well. It's like, how do you how can you I mean, every great show, I love Lucy, whatever, they all eventually ended. How do you kill her off?

Michele:

Oh, you can't. It's like She just I I can't imagine. In our Gramercy Park apartment and happily ever after.

Richard:

Yeah.

Molly:

You know? Yeah. I don't know how.

Michele:

Hopefully not with Amy. Hashtag team big. But okay. Molly, Richard, I cannot thank you enough for giving me this gift of your time and your presence, and this trip has been truly, truly a dream come true. Jet Setters, I cannot wait to tell you more once we finish up this fabulous vacation, and I will talk to you soon.